1370. Gentlemen: Bring Them Back


You’ve heard this before. Life is relative. If women want to see more gentlemanly behavior, they need to act more as ladies.

You can start immediately with no fanfare or preparation. Just silently, patiently, and enjoyably turn the following behaviors into daily habits. Almost subliminal body language combined with repetition, silence, and patience can work wonders.

  • Two couples ride in the same car. The women sit in back. When car stops they continue talking until the men open the doors. (I know. Women prefer to sit with their man, especially up front. It’s okay but no good for teaching gentlemen to treat women as ladies.)
  • Never walk behind your man. Stay up with him so you can nudge ahead and wait at every door, or give some other silent message for him to open it and let you enter first.
  • Teach sons to open and hold doors for mom as soon as son is able. If son is grown, teach him the same way as your husband. (I often see helicopter moms opening and holding doors for elementary school sons. Tsk, tsk. Of course they have a reason, but their sons learn to expect women to cater to masculine whims.)
  • When being seated in restaurants, avoid booths. Patiently stand behind your chair momentarily. Don’t be quick to seat yourself. Lag enough to attract attention that you want help. (Men like to rescue women.) However, never attract more than subliminal attention, never be obnoxious or foot-stomping exasperated. But repeat the pause each time until someone starts to help you be seated. (The first few times will surprise your husband, which isn’t good. To overcome it, smile, wink, and show approval of him before he starts to seat himself. Once he starts the downward motion anyway, seat yourself.)
  • Comment on any gentlemanly behavior you see. Casually praise it in front of all the males present. Cite the behavior which makes you credible for mentioning it; admire the gentleman which impresses the other males that hear you. (You pay attention to their subjects all the time; let them listen to the woman’s side even if it’s not what they want to hear.)
  • If not sooner, then just before they reach puberty give sons a list of gentlemanly behaviors that you enjoy seeing in real men. Give in some permanent form those courtesies that you admire in any man. If sons treasure the list, they treasure you.
  • Early in childhood, let sons overhear mom teaching daughters what to expect out of well-behaved boys and gentlemen. If sons are older and gentlemanly in their behavior, let them help teach sisters.
  • Start giving the civilian salute to servicemen in uniform. (Put your hand over your heart and sweep it forward as if opening your heart.) As you pass, find a greeting that includes “gentlemen” or “sir.” In the case of female warriors, add a nod of the head and “ma’am.” Don’t use masculine or military boldness in such greetings but a ladylike display of respect due to special people. (Such recognition is not too far removed from the respect you should be getting simply because you’re a lady.)
  • Develop this habit. Use some unique and special greeting that you give when you see gentlemanly behavior. For example, a man opens the door and holds it for you. Whether husband is with you or not, say this: “Men are never more handsome than when they show courtesy to women. Thank you.” (Add ‘thanks’ at the end so your comment is heard first by all within earshot.) Especially let your sons and daughters hear you use the greeting whenever possible. (The generality keeps it from being personal but its a loud ‘hoo-rah’ of admiration that men like to hear.)
  • Walk on every man’s left side (if he’s left-handed he may prefer the right). Make it obvious but not obnoxious when you move to that side. Your movement subliminally registers with him that you expect him to protect you. You freed up his weapon arm. (It’s symbolic of course, but symbols have meaning if but to remind men they have obligations with a lady at their side.)
  • Walk alongside but let him lead. (Her Majesty Grace has trouble keeping up sometimes. So, she often slips her hand in mine as inspiration to keep up with my inconsiderate impatience to get wherever I’m going. It has the subliminal effect of slowing me down.)

You no doubt know many other ways to demonstrate ladylike behavior. Try them, you may like them. Not for the effects on your man but for the better way it makes you feel. It can work like 5 mirror time articles starting at post 2123. Keep this in mind whatever you choose to do. Keep a good humor, smile a lot, and enjoy whatever your man does special on your behalf. (To thank him endlessly goes too far. It makes you feel good but not him. He prefers the half-mysterious smile of gratitude that he can translate as admiration.)

38 Comments

Filed under How she wins

38 responses to “1370. Gentlemen: Bring Them Back

  1. Suzy Pens

    Love it! So true! I also know the pride men feel by getting the opportunity to respect women. It makes them shine. 🙂

  2. Karen

    Dear Mr. Guy,

    I can wholeheartedly confirm all of your points. My dear husband has a wonderful example in his own father, and I continually encourage, praise and nurture his wonderful habits (i.e. holding or opening the door for me, carrying my things, helping me with my coat, etc.)

    I very much dress and behave like a lady. I am no longer the youngest of women but men young and old respond positively to a lady. As an example, I was walking my bicycle across an intersection (I was dressed with my summer hat, summer skirt, etc.) and normally the young men fly through there, so therefore I am particularly careful when I have to cross. On this particular day, I paused shortly to let the young man drive by and instead he said “I am more than happy to let a lady pass first”. Of course I smiled and thanked him for his courtesy. I, of course, have no idea if this young man normally stops but it was still a nice gesture upon which I thanked him.

    By the way, I also use the same tactic with my husband (he is considerably taller than me) as your darling wife when he starts walking to fast, by taking his hand. He then smiles at me as states, “I guess that is the gentle hint that I need to slow down a bit” upon which I smile back at him.

    Thank you for a lovely post.

  3. sara

    This is a wonderful list. Thank you for posting. I have to say that I giggled a bit when I read this, “Your movement subliminally registers with him that you expect him to protect you. You freed up his weapon arm.” My husband makes comments that seem excessive to me, but to him it makes perfect sense to have his weapon arm free when he is escorting me to dinner or the movies. This just makes me laugh…though I also deeply appreciate his protective nature. Women just don’t think like that.

    I appreciate your pointers for mothers of sons. We’ve been working on a lot of gentlemanly behaviors in our home lately.

    I think men secretly crave those little golden opportunities to behave like gentlemen towards ladies.

  4. sara

    Oh I forgot to add…..

    I agree that it is good for a woman too. I feel very feminine and lovely when my husband is acting protective and manly towards me. When he is concerned with my well being, opening doors for me, sheltering me, acting like a macho man in order to care for or impress me…..it makes me feel small, womanly, and desirable. I never have put a name to that, but it’s true now that I think about what you wrote.

    Your Highness Sara,
    You make a beautiful bride. With this quote on your gravatar, you sound like the most wonderful of wives: “Being a cheerful woman is the best medicine for almost any situation.”
    Guy

  5. You’ve outdone yourself Guy! I love this list! My husband and I teach our boys that a strong work ethic is a manly trait so from the time our boys are little we praise them for working hard “like a man.” It doesn’t matter if they are pulling weeds in the flower bed we act very happy that they are being “men”.

    Jill Farris
    http://www.generationalwomanhood.wordpress.com

  6. The Staff Sergeant's Wife

    Guy,

    Thank you. This is my husband’s special picture of me. He carries it with him when he goes out to the field on active duty and he also has the original framed on his bed side table. I know I won’t always be young, but even when I’m in the twilight of my life I think he will still think of me as his bride….that’s what I work towards…That is real romance to me.

    I write that quote on all my journals, in my Bible, and I even have it framed on a little magnet on my fridge. (The kitchen is my office.) More than anything else, I’ve noticed how my attitude effects the pleasantness of my home. If my husband comes home from a hard day of slugging it out with the sharks in his office or from a long two week military training camp to meet a disgruntled and annoyed (and conversely annoying) woman his first instinct is to stone wall. No man is going to respond well to a woman who’s all in a fit about something that he sees as quite trivial. I used to get so MAD when he would help with the laundry….because he would always set the dryer to the lowest setting. The clothes would sit in the dryer and get a little stale because they were still a bit moist. This was like an invasion into my realm and it really bothered me. The laundry was my job and I wanted it done my way! How dare he do it wrong! Then I realized that he was just trying to help me. He felt bad about dumping his MMA gear by the laundry room door and expecting me to do it all for him. So he would do it himself out of love for me….Well, now that I realize this I look at his attempts at house work as a real sign of his compassion and thoughtfulness…and I choose to react cheerfully to him (even if I have to go behind him later and redo it when he won’t notice). When I am cheerful he feels proud of himself and more apt to spoil me with attention. This has made a world of difference. The more I apply the cheerful principle to my marriage the better things become. The less cheerful I act the more indifferent he becomes. I think it’s because a man just doesn’t want to be around a frenzied woman who complains and makes him feel bad. So, I put this quote everywhere I can to remind myself. I also love the quote, “Keep calm and carry on.” which I cling to often as a military wife…especially during deployments.

    I love this website Guy. I return here daily to find inspiration and encouragement in my pilgrims progress of wife-hood!

  7. Joanna

    A true inspiration you are to women everywhere, Sara. Sir Guy echoes my thoughts when he comments on your gravatar. I notice how content and happy your husband looks in the pictures. To make one man happy like that is the joy of womanhood. I hope I can do that for someone someday soon. And the only person luckier than him, would be, I now know, and ironically so…me.

  8. ashley

    I’m trying to subscribe to this blog via email.

    Your Highness Ashley,
    You can subscribe on the home page and have each day’s post delivered via email. I don’t know of any other way. Perhaps some cyber-savvy reader does and will respond.
    Guy

  9. I love this list. Its common sense in some ways but purely genius throughout.

    I’ve noticed, in my asian neighbours, that the women tend to ride in the back of the car while their husbands drive in the front. I wondered about this but now I know why,

    Thank you.

    Your Highness Bronzegoddess,
    Welcome aboard. Its a great day when another pretty woman joins us on this cruise to WhatWomenNeverHear.
    Guy

  10. Bill C

    So many complimentary posts…
    About time someone dissented.

    Also, I argue NOT because I think you are wrong, but because the things listed are all PRIVILEGES women EXPECT any more – just from virtue of being women.
    Man can manufacture women; ladies are few and far between, and demanding deference is certainly not going to bring gentlemanly behaviour back. Why should I bother?
    The cliche is worn by stand-up comics any more, but – a man shopping with his wife, standing by the door. He sees a woman approaching, opens the door for her, and is ignored. Another woman comes through, and opens another door rather than enter through the one he opened. Another curses at him for opening the door for her! And when his wife comes, laden with packages, he has decided he won’t bother – and she complains he hasn’t opened the door for her.
    It is no longer hyperbole; google “Misogynists are made, not born.”

    If women want men to be gentlemen, women must be ladies, IN ALL WAYS, not just what benefits them. It is part of an ancient social contract, no longer in vogue, but it requires women to be deferential towards men, too.
    While many of the posts I’ve read have been spot on, this sort of thing is tripe unless the other side is also presented: A shrieking harpy, after all, does NOT inspire men to be gentlemanly, and ONE act of emasculation will ruin a woman in the eyes of any man witnessing it, even if he is not the subject.

    I will try to elaborate more later; but if men are to show deference to women, women must also show deference to men – demanding superior treatment without relinquishing the position of “competitor” will leave women who would be ladies alone and unhappy.

    • gcsfifteen

      dear bill
      i agree with many of the things you say in your post…i think we are all caught in a catch -22 circle… as a woman in this day and age we never know when a door will be held for us or let go in our face(to continue with one of your examples)… not too long ago i was heading for a door when a teenaged boy (16 or 17) and his father were heading for the same door… the boy reached it slightly ahead of me and i half expected him to hold it for me and i had already started a small smile and was ready to say thank you but …not only did he push past me (and i expected his father to correct him and apologize to me) but his father went through too and dropped the door in my face!! i was shocked! i ‘tsk’d’ out loud and shook my head at them sadly and it went unnoticed….however me turning into an impatient foot-stamping woman or screaming harpy would not have made them feel more inclined to treat me as a lady…so what is a woman to do?

      also, if i may beg of sir guy his wisdom, i feel i get caught and confused in the idea of fairness… if a man im casually dating takes me out for a couple/few dinners (and he knows i earn a good living) is it not ‘fair’ for me to show appreciation by inviting him next time and treating him? or insisting to pay next time? or is this making me less valuable? when does a man feel taken advantage of or start to worry a woman may only be interested in his money? is just a simple “thank you” enough?? this man i speak of dating commented how his exwife never appreciated him so i feel this is a sore point for him…while it may be HIS demon to work out how do i not make it worse and show him im a quality woman who is not like that? how do i show him by treating me with respect and devotion i will treat him the same way??

      to play devils advocate, it seems unrealistic to me to be with a man you are not married to; not living with; not sleeping with; dont have children with and expect him to pay for everything…would he not eventually feel like hes being taken advantage of? kind of like what is he getting out of this except for the joy of my company?? is that enough for a man? what am i missing??

      i understand a lot of these concepts you are talking about seem counter intuative to me but im still struggling to understand all of this…i think ive always thought the way to a good relationship is to treat each other as equals…so things are always ‘fair’ and ‘even’…if you do somthing nice for me then i do something nice for you…cater to each others strengths and support each others flaws…help each other…teamwork…i always thought if each of you put the other first before yourself then you shall both always be first..

      so either ive been doing it wrong or ive chosen the wrong men…
      thanks for your kind indulgence on my long post!

      Your Highness Gcsfifteen,

      You keep trying to make things equal or fair, to defend your beliefs. That’s okay. You’re doing nothing wrong, but you may find the final results different than you expect. What you read here is about the nature of men and women and how they can be expected to react when they have no individual reason to do differently. You have reasons to express your personal preference, so continue with what you think is best for you all.

      However, just paying for expenses of dating is not the whole issue. Much more is attached to the dating game you wish to simplify. I suggest you spend time studying many connected issues in the 10-part dating series between posts 484 and 501.

      Guy

      • gcsfifteen

        many thanks again for the reply and the direction for further reading…im not trying to seem argumentative or obstructive (and obviously what ive done in the past didnt work for me) but i AM finding very difficult to wrap my head around some of the ideas.

        i was raised in a very male dominated household with brothers and very little incentive to be feminine or ‘girly’…to this day im still not ‘girly’ but i have learned to be more feminine…but i grew up where being a girl was not an advantage and it meant you were excluded and put down for being somehow ‘less’ than the boys…where showing feminine ‘weakness’ was a bad thing and being treated special meant you were a ‘princess’ and that was a negative thing… i guess that has stuck with me to this day…i think i always thought more like a man than a woman… maybe that has been my downfall…

        Your Highness Gcsfifteen,

        Don’t be so quick to question yourself. You don’t owe anyone an alibi or explanation and it doesn’t help you. It just raises more questions from comparisons.

        Instead, don’t look back. Move forward by testing reality with progress as your goal. You know yourself and how to figure out a man. Use that knowledge and you’ll find a brighter future whether it includes this man or not.

        Guy

        • gcsfifteen

          thank you again
          as always sir guy you have a way with words…im trying my very best by looking back only to remember what to avoid and reading your sage advice on finding a brighter future ahead…i think i deserve it!

    • solocuteduck

      Greetings Bill, I’m 8 months late here and wish I had read this post earlier. Your comments tell me that you are a gentlemen, though a jaded one and that makes perfect sense given the situations you describe (very succinct (?) descriptions by the way of how unladylike women and unfeminine and arrogant behaviours impact on good hearted men who have strong desires to be gentlemen). I agree with everything you say here and unless I’m misreading something I really, truly cannot see how the points in your comment differ in any major way from Mr Guy’s premises.

      As far as I can tell, you both say that women must be ladies and behave accordingly if they wish to have gentlemen emerge and if they wish to encounter gentlemanly behaviour; women will get nowhere by demanding this from men- Guy uses the term obnoxious in this post and advocates that women show respect for men when they behave in gentlemanly ways whilst you make the point by way of those truly salient, accurate and cringe worthy examples (it makes me ashamed for my gender when I see women insulting men who open doors for them, please know Bill that there women out there who are appalled and embarrassed by this kind of behaviour); you both say that women must be ladies in all ways – all guy’s posts concern this finding of femininity and by definitionj (in this blog) femininity includes respect for men as individuals and respect of the entirte gender.as default position.

      Maybe there is confusion around the idea of benefit? I’m not sure but it is true that living as feminine women is of benefit to us as it brings us closer to our natural femaleness and self respect and honour of femininity. From there we are able to respect men as individuakls and as a gender, gentlemenly men such as yourself will respond accordingly and everyone benefits (that’s very summarised and in no way describes how difficult and challenging this is in the world we live in but small steps in an everyday context are a start).

      I’m completely open to being corrected here from yourself, Guy or anyone else and welcome it. I’ll just note that I haven’t got to the end of comment section yet so maybe the mystery will be solved further down the page. I comment as soon as something forms in my mind otherwise liable to lose it, So please pardon me if this question has been resolved further on.

      I really enjoyed your lucid comment Bill and the fact that you are so on the ball..

      Am so enjoying this Blog Guy. It’s pretty hard to convey my admiration for you as a person subtly in cyber space so I’ll just say up front that I admire your qualities of dedication enormously. Thank you again.

  11. Abigail

    Sir Bill (Bill C.), this blog is all about women showing deference to men but if you have some other ways of doing it that the blog author hasn’t discussed yet in other posts, please share them with us.

  12. gonemaverick

    Gcsfifteen,

    whilst awaiting Sir Guy’s answer, may i share with you what i’ve learned here? you asked, “…what is he getting out of this except the joy of my company?” therein lies your answer… the joy of your company because he should be so lucky to be spending time with you. that’s just how much you should value yourself. don’t doubt yourself. don’t question yourself.

    Sir Guy wrote elsewhere, “he pays for everything. pre-engagement, Mickey D’s is better than you paying.” the question is, what are you and your time worth?

    • gcsfifteen

      thank you gonemaverick,
      i guess its part of my nature to feel like i would be treating him unfairly…not that i dont feel im worth it…but i wouldnt feel like id be showing the side of me that would make a good wife (not just the money part) …maybe i equal that to respect…yes he would be treating me with respect but am i treating him the same way? show him that i value him too?

      what other kinds of nice things do women do on this blog to make him feel appreciated and cared for other than kind words? do ladies here invite him for dinner and cook for him? do you do nice/helpful things for him? again…i feel like “what am i missing”?

      ive been in two long term relationships (one of them a 16yr marriage) maybe im just too used to BEING a wife and dont know any other way…it just feels very…selfish… to me…

      • gonemaverick

        Gcsfifteen,

        i understand… but while you’ve been away (married and in a LTR), the dating game was corrupted (i admit, it’s a game).

        the advice here requires a complete mind overhaul. only the hard-headed females survive in the dating game. cast emotions aside and use your head when implementing the advice here.

        re: cooking a meal for him, there’s excellent advice in post 871

        • gcsfifteen

          thank you again gonemaverick…
          i DO feel like ive been away from the game for a long time… i met my ex husband when i was 18…married him at bearly 23 and was with him till 37…and LTR for the last 4yrs…while i did date a few other men (obviously at such a young age they werent serious relationships!) dating at 18 is very different than dating in your 40’s…and yes it does seem like the rules have changed…

          at this point in the game its very difficult to find someone who doesnt have issues or baggage…i include myself in there too…

          i was always the wife who did too much; gave too much; supported too much and sacrificed too much…i wasnt able to have children so all of that was for my husband… i read bills post below and it almost brought me to tears… i too work in a hospital (im not a nurse but i am a front line worker) and i would come home after a 70hr week to a messy house and my husband would have cooked for himself and left nothing for me…dont get me wrong he really is a nice guy but we were very young and i know i created a monster by doing too much… he always was a bit self centered and i know i cultivated it by treating him too well… and taking less than i deserved…so i find it difficult to be “hard headed”…im not even sure i know what that means yet…!

          it took me a long time to learn that being pushed away by my father for being “the girl” and pushed away by my brothers that i was looking for emotionally unavailable men and reliving my childhood experiences in my relationships/marriage… trying to make it right and prove my worth…and that being a “needy girl” wasnt the way to win approval or respect in my house…so im trying to change my way of thinking i need to prove myself worthy to HIM…that it should be the other way around…

          so yes …this IS a complete mind overhaul for me and im struggling to understand this way of thinking (i really find it hard to believe it works but everyone keeps saying it does!)… i always thought relationships should be so simple…i help you…you help me; share everything; support each other… thats why i think ive either been doing it wrong (giving too much) or found the wrong men (emotionally unavailable/immature)…

          im trying to read and learn as many new ways of thinking as i can…comparing what i did in the past to how i should be doing it in the future… hopefully i can learn like we do in the hospital – “see one ; do one; teach one”…im starting to see what you are all talking about…now i have to do it in real life…maybe someday if im lucky i can teach someone else!
          thank you for your input!!
          much appreciated!

  13. Bill C

    Wow, get busy with work for a few days, and find that you’ve become notable (Post 1379), and you owe several people responses. Quite impressive for a hasty, almost nasty commentary…

    First, I noticed in post 1371 the following:

    # I don’t take exception to women in the workforce. They have the right and earned it. However, they bring workforce pressures, manlier habits, and workplace attitudes home and impose them on husband and children. That’s the rest of the story we never hear about. Men expect to compete in a man’s world. When women inject themselves, some spread their female values and expectations that interfere in manly pursuits and spread disenchantment of the female presence, e.g., show more compassion which men resist. Or, some become manlier in order to successfully compete with men, e.g., put career before family. Either way in the home they become less likeable as wives. The former carry frustration and even bitterness home. The latter show less interest to make everything work at home.
    # The female perspective: A woman offers a lot for one man to help fulfill her hopes and dreams. Is he good enough and can she tolerate his shortcomings? The male perspective: A man is expected to give up his independence for one woman. Can and does she make it worthwhile?

    Much of my issues are summed up here, as they tend to be based first in personal, then in public notice. My woman is a “career” type. [excuse my ego and arrogance for a moment, I need to elaborate and will probably be rude about it. being an Executive-level Assistant, especially since arriving there at 45 or so, after multiple jobs in various fields, is NOT a career. There is no rapid advancement, there is a lucky break now and again, and yes, personal skill; but it’s NOT a career any more than my rise in IT has been a career… It’s a pace a glacier would consider lackadaisical. )
    The first citation reflects the attitude: the take-charge, get it done this instant because I thought of it now, shrieking at the dogs who are (as always) under foot, throwing a fit, getting frustrated when the teenager doesn’t do as she’s told and/or mouths off (like mother like daughter?), giving orders and expecting tasks to be completed as she envisioned, whether that’s as requested/defined or not?

    “Turn off” is too anticlimactic. At work, when you support a VP or higher, you have an implicit threat of force to back up any requests. Anyone who refuses to jump when you say, even if it’s on YOUR say so, can expect issues later on – and if not directly targeting them, targeting their boss or group. Not that it MUST be that way, but it easily CAN be that way.

    My ex-GF was a nurse, worked the ER, busted her @$$ for 12 hours a day, and came home so tired she almost crawled to my couch. (my place was closer than hers to her work). Yet she, who had to deal with arrogant doctors, ignorant/angry patients, watch medicines, watch patients, play politics, AND stay educated about her field, PLUS put up with my sometimes less-than-stellar attitude… SHE was able to get me to help out without even ASKING. She was able to show weakness and ask for help without affecting my respect for her. She would often fall asleep on the couch, and I’d make dinner for her. this is after my OWN day of dealing with insane demands and stupid people, mind, for 8+ hours (not as bad, but full-time in IT means you go home, and log on from home. you are never off-tether.) At least after her 12-hours, she got a day off.
    The current GF/pseudo-wife (more on that later) has been out of work mostly (due to a move – job market bad), but since getting a job…? I’ve noticed the SAME attitude. SAME issues, now that she’s working, just – I’m now attuned to the negatives, so I see what SHOULD have been red flags. Yelling at the child, treating me as a child, house is a shambles… No wonder the kid tunes out, it’s the only way to retain any sanity…

    JUST LIKE I DID AT THAT AGE. And I didn’t HAVE friends the way the girl does, there was no Internet… I retreated into books, TV, and computer games (and got yelled at for that), and BTW also got chewed out when I “stole” my father’s weight set (after 5+ years it was still in the box, I finally talked him into “donating” it to me) and started working out – I was getting too “big”, looking like a freak…
    Glossing over things, but – family didn’t like the Nurse GF, she was “manipulative” because she wanted to have a family with me and was pulling for marriage. (And we won’t get into my current situation there. )
    Again glossing over – I see the trend from current GF, to minor things with ex GF, to Mother, to Gradmothers, to Aunt… And then as the “scales fall from the eyes” I see co-workers, teachers, friends, my SISTER – ALL doing the SAME EXACT things. All manipulative, all playing with emotions, all causing themselves and others much heartache – AND MUCH OF IT IS WITH MALICE AFORETHOUGHT.

    So to think of even the “old timers” as “ladies” is incredibly difficult. I do in fact believe women are responsible for, and cause, more problems and conflicts than men do, and most KNOW what will happen. Whether it is part of being a fallen creature or not – it takes a civil man and makes a beast. Cornered animals give no quarter, and men most definitely are cornered – look at a woman the wrong way, and it’s rape, even if she’s humping a guy at the bar WHILE you look. If the bar patrons won’t come to her “defense”, the man will, or the police can be summoned, and the “offender” is put on trial, whether the event happened or not.

    This is to be paragon of virtue, the mother of your children, pure as new-fallen snow?

    Impossible. So my thoughts are tainted from the start, and the manipulations that put me through bankruptcy, foreclosure, begging my father for funds to pay the heating bill in winter. and the MANIPULATIONS OF MY MOTHER AT THAT POINT!!! (As well as others) aimed specifically at SHAMING ME and HURTING ME (and before, girls I’d brought home)… It’s a good thing I’m a “sexist pig”, or there’d be a whole lot more violence in the world…
    (Breaking as I anticipate size limits, and nothing more relevant to say on this.)

  14. Bill C

    So, to continue with the IMPORTANT part of my response.

    First, To Abigail (09/07/2011 at 10:11 am):
    1. Very pretty name. 😉
    2. I really have only one answer, but it’s an ideal, not an action: RESPECT. A man who “settles down” is relinquishing his freedom. This is part of the ideal of romance novels, where the female protagonist captures the male’s heart. Having read a few of these books myself, I will tell you – there is a GREAT DEAL of manipulation done to MANY men in these books. This is how the female “wins”. Unfortunately, I didn’t realize what I was reading, as I was a teenager. The analogous acts for a male are slaying dragons, chasing pirate treasure, traveling to distant lands. There may be violence involved, but just as not everyone gets what they want in the bodice-rippers – same in the adventure stories. Different audience, different methods of manipulating the outcome – but the adventure stories have been painted as “immoral” while the emotional pornography in the bodice-rippers is “moral”.
    Uh, No. Further, while OT for this blog, if the emotional porn is allowed, women CANNOT condemn men for engaging in visual porn. Double standard, smacks of hypocrisy and disrespect.
    A man sacrifices all that “MIGHT HAVE BEEN” for his woman (as I’ve had to do in my current situation). His dreams disappear, are replaced by “their dreams” (or sometimes by nothing). his wants don’t matter; the FAMILY matters. He shows his love by being patient in his suffering, if it helps the family. It is almost masochistic, but to give up his poker games, his carousing with friends, his drinking, his freedom, for responsibilities? It truly is unnatural, as most of these “responsibilities” come from social expectations imposed by… women. He works to supply the income; she can work, not work, even pursue her own dreams, as circumstances “allow”; have children or not, and if she has children, she will use them against her husband (or the step-father) as emotional blackmail, even if she has a nanny or “help” to take care of them. A child is an “extension” of a woman, a part of her being… (Hence the helicopter mom, and yes, I had an early version).
    What does a man get in this relationship? As gcsfifteen asked:
    to play devils advocate, it seems unrealistic to me to be with a man you are not married to; not living with; not sleeping with; dont have children with and expect him to pay for everything…would he not eventually feel like hes being taken advantage of? kind of like what is he getting out of this except for the joy of my company?? is that enough for a man? what am i missing??

    I will answer you bluntly: He feels used, abused, taken advantage of, and sometimes suicidal, and sometimes homicidal. Especially if it also has non-monetary costs, such as losing contact with friends and family, giving up a degree that was ALMOST completed, living in effective poverty where he cannot get “little things” like Starbucks or go out for a beer with co-workers. Especially if the woman in question, once securing a long-term interest (in our case a house) proceeds to make herself unsocial, and ensures through (I hope subconscious) actions to make his life miserable – denying hobbies, time alone, time without stress and noise – well, she might not wake up one day. It’s just NOT WORTH IT.
    A man learns the hard way to not give in, to not take care of, this woman – she’s obviously doing it for herself. (Especially if she states that she doesn’t need help, and doesn’t need him – words proven lies by the very situation, as she never had a CHANCE to buy a house before him.) now, you’ll rightly state, what about the OTHER women in this man’s life? Is he hurt and bitter purely because of ONE woman, and playing up the drama?”
    1. Drama? Probably a little.
    2. No – many women. GF1 wanted to get married – but at the time, so did I. My mother dressed her down, belittled her: “I think it’s time for your little friend to go.” DIRECT. QUOTE. to an RN with a better GPA than I had, to a girl who OBVIOUSLY was important, given it was several months we’d been dating, and she’d been working in the Real World and living ON HER OWN for several months, too (prior to my meeting her, a year or more at the time of this incident.). So, Ok, Mom leaves a nasty scar on the psyche; how about grandma? Well, she played the invalid role – would send mom to the corner store to get “eggs, just eggs”… and when mom gets back, “Oh, we need milk…”, and.. rinse and repeat, if you will – to a woman in college, trying to get her schoolwork done. (and we wont’ get into the other games, just highlight one that was played often.)
    So, school teachers? Other mothers? generic answers, “NIMBY”, “MY child would never do that…”, “girls get BETTER treatment in my class” (Because they were so oppressed in the bad old days…)

    I will try to keep the invective out, but I hope you’ll see the disrespect inherent in what I’ve listed, not just for a man or woman receiving the treatment, but for the very HUMANITY of the target. Accidents happen; a pattern of abuse shows it ain’t no accident. Further, 1378 and 1380 cover a lot of the fallout, too – a woman who is always pushing, always manipulating those around her is VERY insecure. After a while, she is not trusted by those around her; she also KNOWS she is out of control and therefore doesn’t respect herself.
    As a man, though? it is NOT my job to be her psychotherapist and resolve her mommy/daddy/brother/sister/god/devil/WHATEVER problems. I am not her emotional tampon, either (been there, done that, USED to be a gentleman and a nice guy.)

    Respect is NOT having dinner on the table when he walks in the door. (I acknowledge it may be an attempt to respect him, though.) It is not a spic-n-span house, always smelling of pinesol.
    A clean house is essential, though, and if you claim you cleaned the whole house and he comes home and sees dust bunnies on the stairs, under the tables, under the chair… but you’ve spent 15 minutes detailing how thorough you were? He knows two things: 1 – you’re a liar, and cannot be trusted; 2 – he can’t call you on it, because you’re so dishonest with yourself it will be (another) fight. His only real options are to drop you (Detail the reasons, ask you to leave, and state he only dates honest women), or to try and use the “Dig whisperer” methods (google also “wife whisperer”) of positive reinforcement, and then hope you’re smart enough to be trainable. (Mine makes a mule look cooperative – it was only by being a complete A-hole and caring ONLY for myself that she woke up to reality, and it’s still a somnambulist’s awareness.)
    Precise methods will vary by relationship. If he is on an assembly line all day, some peace and quiet when he comes home might be what is needed. If his day is books and academia, maybe a dinner out is needed, or a movie (Netflix? Redbox?), or some music and a major presentation of dinner.
    and if he is a good man, he will reciprocate – massages, cleaning up after dinner, doing electrical wiring, plumbing, etc. But no double-standards: don’t expect that he should let you have your “free time” or “girl time” if you won’t afford him that EXACT SAME courtesy of “Guy Time”. Don’t say in a discussion about finances, when he’s saying that your hobby is too costly, that it’s not THAT much, because he spends $50 on a repair book for your vehicle. Don’t claim he doesn’t support you, if following that discussion, he spends into the red so you have a cashbbox for your hobby-turned-business.
    Don’t harass a man for never being home, never attending to your needs, if he’s gone from 6 AM until sometimes 9 PM to make ends meet and stay employed – he had to choose, you or the job, and since the job actually PAYS THE BILLS…. What he WANTS is of no importance, it’s what YOU (and he) NEED that determines his course of actions.

    It’s all those things that make him a “pushover”, regular Joe, or “Nice Guy” – which indicate beyond any shadow of a doubt that you don’t respect him as a man, or a human being, because his best efforts are never good enough – and you are a black hole, taking resources he can never recover – like TIME, which could be put to better use securing education for better job, and a mate who DOES respect him.

    • Abigail

      Ah Bill, it pains me to read this things but I know they are often true. My heart goes out to you and gender. It truly does.

      Thank you for liking my screen name. I chose it myself.

  15. Bill C

    Last one, a soundbyte-summary:
    – Find what your man sees as showing respect; do those things. When you do, “suggest” he reciprocate with the things you want. If he responds happily and freely, you are doing well; if after 30 days of training in the new “rituals”, he gives dirty looks, you’re obviously missing on showing him the respect. Try again, maybe ask directly. you’re only asking for directions. Also ask why he has issues with your requests; maybe he drank the kool-aid.
    – Reciprocity is also key: If he starts off opening doors for you, seating you first, wants to be near you, touching you – that’s good. If he stops, especially if he sort of drifts away – YOU are probably the cause. Review your behavior, realize if you ARE the cause, you ARE the solution, and take actions to fix the problem – even if it means tying him to the couch to talk, and then begging for forgiveness. You might be the straw that broke the camel’s back, but he sees every woman who ever did something wrong, all at once, all hammering him again. For him to unlearn the negativity of that life will take time – maybe years. And years of work can be destroyed by a single moment’s carelessness.

    The damage is society-wide. You cannot fix everyone, but you can ensure he feels safe with you – just as you want to be safe with him. If you do not want him to judge you for your wild past in your mis-spent youth, don’t judge him for his porn/love of animals/$10,000 bicycle/comic book collection.
    You set the ground rules already (no judging), violate them at your own hazard.

    Perhaps a great example, from the Ex-GF. I was raised to ALWAYS pay – just who I am, how I was raised, man pays. The Ex always had her money ready, even when we were dating, and I usually refused (She didn’t always take it out, so I didn’t always refuse). the funny part was, probably around 4th date or so, I had to go the men’s room, and the server brought the check while I was there – and the Ex had it paid before I got back. I gave her a dirty look, she gave a coy smile, and then it became a game – who paid the check first. (I usually won.) It wasn’t an attack on me as a provider, it was an “I can do that, too, and I can take care of you, too.” Perhaps I’m odd that way, maybe most men would see it as a problem; to me, it was a certainty she wasn’t a gold-digger, and she didn’t want me to spend all my resources on her when we could do it together.
    Contrast with the current GF who, after I bought her flowers once, started buying flowers while we were on a shoestring budget, and would say, “Look at the beautiful flowers you bought me!” I didn’t look at them, choose them, say you could choose to expend my paycheck on them (a concern after the 4th or 5th time)… Petty? Yes. Still a problem to the National Bank of Bill… It was expected, it’s devalued as a gift, I’m devalued to being an ATM… There is no relationship any more.

  16. gcsfifteen

    hearing bills opinion is what confuses me…
    i also have a single male friend in my age group (40ish) and he says the same thing about dating…women just want to know you have money… he feels women are only looking for men who can pay for them (and sometimes their children from previous relationships) or support them or keep them in some type of lifestyle to which they have become accustomed.

    im wondering if we (those of us who are slightly more mature and have been in previous marriages/LTRs) are bound to the same rules as those in their 20s who are just starting out; maybe still in school or living at home. since ive been in committed relationships i feel like the best way to show me you love/respect me are beyond money… in other words i dont need to be bought things or have it paid for me…i work…i have money…i want you to keep your promises…i want you to work as a team…i want you to communicate your wants/needs/fears/hopes… i want you to come home because you want to come home not because you have to…

    i think people like bill…like me…have been burned by people with less scruples than our own…bill – you sound like a nice man who tried to be a good and loving partner and chose the women who couldnt appreciate you…i am a woman who appreciates a good man but chose men who were self centered and wanted a woman to cater to them… where is the fine line between being taken advantage of and doing something out of love for the person you love? i realize part of my issue is doing too much…and it has backfired on me…but…

    if i begin dating a nice man and let him pay for the first few dinners/dates (obviously stay chaste); avoid the topic of marriage/future together; make him do all the work to impress me and chase me to show me he is interested… how or what do i have to do to show him i am interested back without seeming like a gold digger? or someone who wants to be treated like a princess? just like i would never bring up the topic of marriage before its time why would he not be thinking in his head but not saying “wow is she always going to ask me to pay? will it be like this when we are married? that i will have to do ALL the work?” and he may end the relationship prematurely …he may think im after the money or lazy or just looking for a man to take care of me so i dont have to do it myself…im sure most men, even if they are interested in you or care for you, after a while would start to wonder….

    i have heard people say “men dont like relationships that are too hard” so most men will look for easy… but like guy says: if you give up easy sex or do EVERYTHING for him you are probably setting yourself up for heartache …so if you make it too easy you lose …but from what bill is saying if its too hard you lose…so where is the fine line??

    i would love to hear from more men…the mature men…or divorced men… we are the tender souls who have been wounded and are still hopeful good people exist…but we have fears borne out of experience…how as a woman do i stand so firm to demand a man treat me as i deserve(MY fear that i will be taken advantage of) when he is wounded too and looking not to be taken advantage of again(when he has probably been ripped apart in a divorce) and probably wants a woman to treat him more fairly?

  17. Abigail

    I have the same questions gcsfifteen has. I’ve been seeing a man who I know isn’t rolling in dough and it’s so hard to let him pay for things but I’ve been told, if I don’t, he will take it as a sign of disinterest from me and that he wants to do it and it makes him feel good to do it. And I know he has been wounded by at least one woman. So it’s hard to know what to do sometimes! Maybe I should just talk to him about it…

    • gcsfifteen

      abigail
      i agree where you are coming from…but why would it be a sign of disinterest if you pay once in a while? or every other time? whatever works for you guys? wouldnt he feel like you are understanding his financial situation and not overburdening him?
      i agree men like to ‘take care of us’ and it makes them feel good…but where is the happy limit??

      gentlemen? opinions?

      • Bill C

        Abigail, gcsfifteen, since you’re asking the same questions, I’ll try to answer together.
        First: gcsfifteen said:
        if i begin dating a nice man and let him pay for the first few dinners/dates (obviously stay chaste); avoid the topic of marriage/future together; make him do all the work to impress me and chase me to show me he is interested… how or what do i have to do to show him i am interested back without seeming like a gold digger? or someone who wants to be treated like a princess?

        Hitting “middle age” is a major problem in that it changes our entire chemical makeup. Especially for men, since the “cloud of testosterone” fades as the body shouldn’t be quite as concerned with procreation. (The “cloud” makes everything with boobs look good, ladies – you don’t have a CLUE about that drive, or how the male is drawn by it; it is like a bonfire, as the fire consumes everything. Brighter, hotter, then cooling down, then burning bright again, in a matter of seconds. So too with a man looking at women – like the moth to the flame… Except the man knows he’ll get burned and goes anyway..)

        So the drive will abate for men, though each is different in how this manifests – I have one male friend that is so ruled by his little head, at 50+, he makes college frat boys look like cloistered nuns… 😛
        But, while you likely have more of an option for discussing long-term plans, and less “reputation” to worry about (let’s face facts, you’ve been married, and you’ve not had a divine conception – we know that), he is now starting to worry about his future even if he’s alone – and that does mean finances. For me, I don’t mind treating a woman like a princess – as long as she treats me like a prince. (Note, I didn’t say king.) right now, if the GF demands to pay the tab (until recently – no longer true!) it came from MY earnings anyway – so what’s the point? It was a gesture based on a superficial lie. Now that she has income, if she pays from the joint account, that would be an insult. (to illustrate; we assume she keeps her funds only in her account. this is not how it works, but makes the point.)

        I am straying, let me get back to the bottom line here: You say you want him to chase you. Yet how do you show him you are interested? First, if you haven’t shown interest, he won’t bother to chase. Second, the games don’t work, men are less inclined to put up with BS and more interested in an honest and attractive woman than a hottie with baggage. Third, the solution is simple in a sense: Chase him back! Coy still works, subtlety still works, but no chasing means no interest. No ice queen, maybe some hard to get would work (PUA would refer to it as push-pull, also used in training dogs where you “fade the lure”). But don’t expect the man to do ANYTHING (Just like he shouldn’t expect se_x when he pays for dinner, you shouldn’t expect dinner if you offer se_x, if you follow my meaning. What you give is a gift; what he gives is a gift; if you give each other what you need and want, you’ll be successful; if you EXPECT anything – even such simple things as opening the doors or seating you first – then it’s not a gift any more – it has become an OBLIGATION on him,unilaterally imposed by you, without his consent. Silence is NOT consent, he just doesn’t know how to respond to the blindside, and will likely start to withdraw – and if you have other hooks in him as well, he will start to question your objectives – as I did with the current GF I cannot free myself from. (*)

        Specific examples of what to do: Cook him dinner at your house for a night in. Big plus if it’s also your first “night together”, unless you DO have a reputation (Blanche Devereaux of Golden Girls?) – in which case, it won’t matter what you do: Fail to “deliver” and you’re a tease, deliver and you’re “easy”. THAT is the type of reputation to avoid. I’d guess as long as you can count partners on one hand, you’re probably fine. 😉 (That goes for men, too.)
        Clean his place, too. It can be a date, especially if he’s reverted to “bachelor chic”. The two of you working together are working on a collaborative partnership; exactly what long term relationships should be.
        He or you have pets? Ask for help walking the dog, or offer to walk with him if you’re local. Stop by work at quitting time. Have a night out with the girls, then stop at his place for coffee. (obviously, call and set it up ahead of time.) Movies at either place, especially suggestive ones (Not necessarily soft-core porn, but maybe something like “Princess Bride” with you nibbling his earlobe now and then… the suggestive is more on your end there; Or, some foreign films show an awful lot without being pornographic, and then just a touch or caress – as you or he reach for the fast forward button – can work well.)
        What are your and his interests? Paintball? Go out as a team. Rowing? find someplace to rent a kayak or canoe, pack a picnic. You have children, and the relationship IS going somewhere? Plan a busy day that will give the kid(s) time with your intended – as they need to work things out, too. Maybe you need to run to the store for part of the dinner. This way they can talk without your ears and eyes studying them.

        Some of those are a little duplicitous, but they will work, especially if NOT done with manipulative intent. OTOH, if you suggest dinner and a movie and are unwilling to pay? You’re a gold-digger, whether you realize it or not.
        The joke goes:
        A man walks up to a woman in a bar, says, “Will you sleep with me for a million dollars?”
        “YES!” she exclaims.
        “How about $20?”
        “What do you take me for, a common whore?”
        “Madam, we both know what you are, we’re just negotiating price.”

        Not so funny when it’s in-context, is it?
        If you have a price, we know it. If we have a price, you’ll know it. Those who cannot be bought are generally lonely.

        (*) With her name on the mortgage, and my accounts, and the fact she was unemployed? Who would the bank come after? Not her! The one with the job… If she gets hurt and goes to the ER with any visible bruising, I could end up in prison on the physician’s say-so, and it would be sorted out later. Women wanted “equality” in words, but demanded superiority – which, BTW, is what chivalry is all about – elevating women! “Sir Gawain and the Green Knight”, period literature, he has Saint Mary on the inside of his shield; further, historical analysis shows how Mary was elevated to a goddess-like status as a political move to combat pagan religions. Now, with the individual supreme over the family, the State is the “husband” to women. Think about that…. He talks harshly? Abuse. Refuses to talk? Abuse. Leaves during an argument? Abuse. Etc, etc, etc. Look it up, Q.V. Duluth Model.

        • gcsfifteen

          thank you bill
          and a lot to think about! and i would be very curious to hear how sir guy views our exchanges here and his opinions…

          in my particular situation i have two men with whom i am currently considering attempting a relationship to try and get to know them better and see if there is potential to pursue… there has been two dates with one (he paid but not without me asking if i can at least share the tab) and one im emailing with …both i know through the hospital so i want to be very careful (even though i am ‘mature’) i wouldnt want a reputation as the town bike-where everyone has had a ride…so im not ready to include any other activities other than chaste dates…

          im also trying to figure out if one of the men is really after a ‘friends with benefits’ type relationship…divorced; burned; gun- shy is he but seems very interested in me…tells me im ‘easy on the eyes’…flirts… but when i show a bit more interest he seems to get scared and run away… ive suggested we stay friends for now and see how it goes…but hes come back to me on/off over the years we have known each other…so bill i had to giggle when you say “what do you do to show him you are interested?”… he knows… ive put it out there… hes trying to bite…but cant seem to do it…since we are coworkers im going to be friendly at work and just leave it for him to think about…if he wants he will have to do it at his own speed…

          *sigh* this is what plagues the wounded souls…

          Your Highness Gcsfifteen,

          You say, “I would be very curious to hear how sir guy views our exchanges here and his opinions…” Okay, here it is.

          Sir Bill C and I talk about different people. I focus on the natural traits of two very different sexes and show the compatibility that can flow there from. He focuses on the emotional expressions of two sexes that should act more alike in order to build short-term compatibility. Our foundations are miles apart. Women have heard his arguments for decades. They’ve not heard mine yet, but I’m still working on it after 45+ months of daily posts.

          That’s enough for now. I know you still look for an excuse to justify your sense of equality and fairness about paying for things. So, just do it. You’re the only one that will lose in the long run. Ask yourself: How, why, when, and where did your other relationships travel and end under your sense of equality and fairness?

          Guy

          • gcsfifteen

            dear sir guy
            you sound exasperated with me…im not trying to argue nor look for excuses to justify…obviously my previous relationships ended for a reason… was it because i was trying to be “fair”?… well i dont know that for sure… maybe… maybe it created an imbalance in the relationship even though i was striving for balance…

            but this is why im here…to gather different ways of thinking and try it and see if it works…my confusion isnt only about the paying… it just happened to be the example i chose and i guess it hit an nerve with people and escalated from there…

            im asking these questions because im trying to learn… and UNlearn certain ways of thinking …both things are very difficult…maybe because of my medical background im a “why” person… so i look for “why”…but im here to learn so i hope you dont mind if occasionaly i ask… why?
            your humble servant
            gcsfifteen

            Your Highness Gcsfifteen,

            I’m not exasperated with you at all. Perhaps with myself but that’s another story and I regret it reflected onto you.

            If you truly want to learn, then seek it straight from the only foundation that undergirds all the mixing of emotions, beliefs, and opinions. Study the blog more broadly and more deeply. Far more thoughtful relevance lies there than in the often flippant or self-centered opinions offered in the comment section and from which you cannot determine the foundation of the author’s beliefs such as their religion, ambitions to influence others, and unwillingness to ID facts that don’t promote their position.

            Be aware of this. The mind learns better and more effectively when reading with no one else involved. The clutter and confusion factors are greatly reduced. Your mind takes in, evaluates, accepts or rejects, and moves on with fewer interruptions in your thought processes. Reading is so much more mentally stimulating than TV, for example. Reading in the comments section, however, the author’s emotions stir your own for good or bad and mix them with my writing. Confusion is left and not much learning occurs. Also, the full picture doesn’t accompany the issue as well as is done, or I try to do, within the blog articles.

            Guy

          • solocuteduck

            Mr Guy, Ok, regarding my initial reply to Bill C’s post; I got to the end of the relevant comments and I think the issue of where Bill C and you differ is now resolved for me – it is no longer the issue. Bill C had something in his subsequent posts about respect and i pricked up my ears but I could not wade through all of his personal issues invading the conversation, a massive red flag hoisted itself skyward and I withdrew, Perhaps Mr Bill needed a place to off load his angst and frustration – I seriously wonder if he was trying to subvert some homicidal tendencies- but what a mess of ideas the above turned out to be IMO. Your response to where Bill C was coming from is enough to refocus me back on blog issues and keep strengthening my own learnings. Your advice below about posts and comments.and learning are also duly noted. Thanking you.

  18. Sir Guy:

    I love this post! Today I had a first date with a gentleman. He’s French but has lived in the United States for 20 years and previously lived in Japan. He’s also 46 years old (vs my 50) so I’m sure he’s well aware of ways to court a lady. However, when he picked me up he didn’t open the car door for me. He just got in the car and leaned over to open the door for me. I got in the car but mentally made a note of his behavior (but of course I didn’t let my body language express my thoughts). We then went on a pleasurable hike through the woods. When we returned to his car I stood by the door as he reached in his backpack for his keys. He electronically unlocked the door and got in the car. Since he didn’t open the car door for me I then also got in the car.

    Interestingly, as we departed he mentioned that he would open the door next time. I casually touched his hand and smiled, not saying a word. We made a stop at a store and he told me to wait. He then came around to open the door. When we returned to the car he once again opened the door for me and did so again when we returned to my home. When he left I gave him a hug and he said “We have to do this again.” Time willl tell if he calls me for a second date but I was pleased by his behavior.

    You are so right that men have to be subtly reminded when they are in the prescence of a lady. There are probably few women today who appreciate chilvalry but I’m one of them. Thanks for the wisdom you’ve expressed.

    Lady Arabella Victoria

  19. Sbaby

    Sir Guy:

    Should I request (through indirectness and charm) my date to open the car door for me next time he drives me to the restaurant / home, when we have already formed the habit where I simply open the car door by myself each time? We had been friends for a long while before we started going out, and during that time I hadn’t read your blog yet and also I was influenced by a female friend (I’m from Hong Kong by the way) who once told me that it is impolite to sit at the back of someone’s car if there are no other passengers except the driver. Maybe her opinion is actually in the minority, and is also not applicable to this context of developing gentlemanly habits, but because of this, since then I have always – without fail – automatically hopped onto the car seat next to my date.

    I am scared that if I suddenly change my behaviour, he will actually take it unfavourably and think that I’m acting like a demanding diva and an unreasonable woman.

    Does the failure to “coach” a man into developing the gentlemanly habits you list make me less valuable and respectable in his eyes?

    Your Highness Sbaby,

    Continue just as you’ve been doing. It’s too late on current dates. However, everytime you see any man do a gentlemanly thing for a woman, cite it in everyday conversation. Such as, “Did you see that? I love to see men who act so gentlemanly.”

    With other dates, stand by the door and expect them to open it for you. Keep smiling as they try to figure out just what it is you want them to do. If they won’t do it or don’t understand, open the door for yourself and proceed politely and smilingly as if nothing untoward happened.

    Your female friend doesn’t understand the question or issue. Dates never sit in the rear.

    You ask, “Does the failure to “coach” a man into developing the gentlemanly habits you list make me less valuable and respectable in his eyes?” Not the failure to coach, but the failure to expect gentlemanly behavior, YES. You have no obligation to coach him, but you should let him know he has an obligation to honor your wishes, standards, and expectations. Subtleness, indirectness, charm, and seed planting are the inoffensive ways to let it be known.

    Guy

  20. Sbaby

    Sir Guy,

    Your response is extremely helpful. Many blessings to you!

  21. Lovely

    Can there be a series if not a part 2 on this? I would love to know more about this and more examples would greatly help.

    Your Highness Lovely,
    Probably. I’ll look into it after I either complete or fall on my sword about the pinkie finger promise. If you’ve heard nothing by mid-March, tell me I dropped the ball, please.
    Guy

    • Lovely

      If you aren’t too busy, could you look into the “Gentlemen: Bring them back” series?

      Your Highness Lovely,
      I’ll try to get to it next week.You have any ideas or particulars floating around in your noggin?
      Guy

      • Lovely

        Preferably tips like those above such as waiting by the chair to be seated and other ways to inspire gentlemanly behavior. Additionally, since after childhood mothering we are responsible for the rest in teaching gentlemanly behavior, maybe some example scenarios if possible? The advice to sit in the back of the car as part of inspiring gentlemanly behavior was an eye-opener as I had never heard of this before.

        Your Highness Lovely,
        Heads up tomorrow, darling.
        Guy

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