We return to the workings of the male mind, as it considers asking for first date.
Impressions are stronger than facts, because we’re emotional creatures. Mystery about her sexual proclivities works best to attract his asking for first date.
© Men admire chastity in a woman, but they don’t hit on nuns. Why? Respect, of course, and lack of hope. As Emerson claims: The world turns on hope.
© If hopeful of sex and he’s not playing it vague and unavailable, he normally asks for a date. If she declares, avows, or everyone knows that she’s into no sex without marriage, she eliminates hope and might as well be in nun’s habit. Why ask for date unless he already seeks to marry on her terms?
© Mystery surrounding her chasteness is stronger and more a challenge than is the certainty or absence of it. A sprinkling of suspicion about her standards does far more to capture a man’s curiosity and spark his imagination for conquest, hence make him more likely to ask her out.
© Mystery pays. Smiles without reason, friendliness without eagerness, and preliminary conversation without sex overtones pays off. Familiarity reduces mystery and works against her. Sex lures and objectification, for example, reduce risk for him. It also reduces respect and value for her.
© Females fish with full disclosure, as if males appreciate it as women do. This gives a male time and info to reduce his risk of rejection. First date may result, but less risk means weaker investment of his Self, which means less value and respect for her, which weakens prospects for second date.
Summarizing, chasteness earns a man’s respect and admiration, but his knowledge of its certainty can discourage asking for first date.
What Women Never Hear 
“If hopeful of sex and he’s not playing it vague and unavailable, he normally asks for a date. If she declares, avows, or everyone knows that she’s into no sex without marriage, she eliminates hope and might as well be in nun’s habit. Why date unless he already seeks to marry on her terms? ”
Yep- story of my life. This explains why I have to date outside my circle of friends (where I can date like a queen), or why I had to date outside of school because when one man found out I’m waiting until marriage- word gets around. The only men who initiated pursuit or continued to pursue me knowing my status have been mostly Christian men who are waiting also, or men who saw it as a challenge. I am so mum on the issue now….and let the guys try to figure it out…at least until the point of them pressuring me either verbally or non verbally.
I correct myself. There was one guy who stalked me after I dumped him. He knew I was waiting…and told me he wanted to marry me.
Dear Guy,
I should have written you sooner to say how much I love your blog. What is most helpful to me is that your messages put into simple terms and steps what biblically is sometimes a bit difficult to translate to everyday behavior. I nearly always agree wholeheartedly with your sentiments, so my apologies for my first contact being one of dissent.
I have to say I don’t quite agree with not disclosing one’s chastity. “Why date unless he already seeks to marry on her terms? Exactly my point. I don’t want to waste my time or theirs. Mind you, I don’t get on a foghorn to the world, nor tell every guy who is interested this (serious inquiries only), but any persistent questions as to why I won’t sleep with them, or direct questioning in that area is an indication to me that the truth needs to be put plainly, as this is something that is important to them-whatever that means for their intentions for the future. In fact, I feel I have a personal responsibility to share my spiritual reasons why not in that case, as well as not leading them on. This further separates the good from the bad for me.
According some of your own previous posts, admittedly, men now are not used to women telling them no. In past generations, it was common knowledge for men that women were waiting for marriage. You have even stated that, and also that men get angry now when refused-mainly because usually now this is not this case. To me, this further drives to point home for a bit of “re-education.” If it was more plainly stated in the past the reason for refusal and men clearly behaved better than, I believe there is an even greater need for them now to know.
A side note to easybreezy, most people don’t know my stance only because they don’t get that far enough with me, but I have always looked at those other people who may find out and spread around the fact that I am waiting for marriage as part of my personal PR committee. It is far more effective for other people to help get the message out if need be. It further helps keep those who aren’t really interested away. It simply isn’t worth the trouble for them.
“Summarizing, chasteness earns a man’s respect and admiration, but his knowledge of its certainty can discourage asking for first date.” I personally want him to be discouraged if my chastity dissuades him in the first place. Furthermore, aren’t we supposed to be equally yoked? If this is someone I am having to beat around the bush with in regards to chastity, clearly he is a Christian in name only and not behavior, or a non-Christian who is not interested in becoming spiritually minded. I run like the plague from the former, and consider the latter only if they are truly interested in getting closer to God.
There is a quote by an author unknown to me that a woman’s heart should be so close to God that a man must seek Him to find her. How can a man get to Him then, if he does not know our position, where we stand on things as important as this. Paraphrasing a bible passage, how are we to be the light of the world if we hide our lamps?
I agree per many of your posts that full disclosure is usually not best and typically unnecessary anyway. But on the issue of chastity, at least in the case of a serious inquiry, I must respectfully disagree and assert that we have a responsibility to state the reason for our stance.
Your Highness Reina,
We’re not in disagreement. Stacy in the next comment clarifies it better than I can.
Guy
Reina,
You don’t really have to “announce” it. Most men figure it out for themselves by the way you carry yourself and interact with them, both in public and on dates/in private. Usually, by the time it gets to a point where the woman “feels” that she has to tell him, she should have probably already left the relationship/stopped dating him, because he’s probably been acting like a cad and red flags are all over the place…the persistence about sex is just icing on the arselike-behavior cake.
I mean, really, all a woman has to say is that she isn’t into casual sex or “I’m not into sleeping with someone I’m just dating” and then STICK TO THAT STATEMENT.
Men know what’s going on. They aren’t stupid. They play on the fact that women *think* they are….but they aren’t.
Less is more. Men aren’t keen on a woman going on and on about things. Besides, if you turn it into a lecture on your state of affairs, all you’re going to do is put yourself in a position where he’s going to try to argue you out of it. It’s their nature. If you feel you have to go on and on about it…you’re kind of indicating that you aren’t resolute in your position. It’s as if in trying to “convince” him, it’s as like you’re trying to convince yourself. No need. A simple statement is all it takes and then let your actions match your words.
If a guy keeps bringing it up, RE-PEAT-ED-LY, I see that as a red flag and you should stop dating the man.
ps–The only real “non-dating” scenario is engagement/marriage…anything else is conversation. It’s all “just dating” until you both say those “I dos.” Lol! ;>
Thank you, Guy and Stacy,
Stacy,
I agree to and extent with the “red flags” issue, but not completely. I cannot overly generalize and say that most men were acting like cads when I felt the need to say something, because most were not. They were, however, unclear about why I wasn’t having sex with them. This sadly is in part due to the fact that, dare I say it, most churchgoing, “nice” girls, still end up having sex with someone they have been dating for a while. If it were back in the day, I believe you would be spot on. There was a different understanding then, and a very different one now. I believe the way society is now has made it not quite that simple. There are a different set of social mores at work now, which we must then deal with.
“I mean, really, all a woman has to say is that she isn’t into casual sex or “I’m not into sleeping with someone I’m just dating” and then STICK TO THAT STATEMENT. I tried the whole “I’m not in to casual sex” line, and found that ends up still being muddy for men. That might lead them to stick around longer because they think they will just have to wait around a bit more. The world is such now that MOST people (and I mean 90-something %) “just do it” so the expectation is there for that, not that the woman is abstaining. It typically won’t even cross their mind. I don’t even personally know anyone else who is abstaining. True, men aren’t stupid, but MOST men don’t expect to wait for marriage anymore because of this paradigm shift. I have found chastity to be so rare now that many people will not understand “why not” without some clarity. MOST will assume it is some other reason (usually a refusal of them personally)and it can get downright nasty if they feel they have been led on. I remember another post from guy that spelled this out perfectly and I could totally relate. I guess it depends on how you see fit to deal with that. I prefer to be a bit more direct in this area when necessary and let the chips fall where they may now, so I don’t have to deal with the fallout later.
I agree about the “just dating” part. I have never quite liked the whole girlfriend/boyfriend concept. If people were courting the way they did in the past, neither would be in some sort of pseudo-committed relationship which holds them back from being objective, getting to know other people and can impede them from marriage. I do like the statement “I’m not into sleeping with someone I’m just dating.” When guys learn your dating philosphy, they quickly and clearly get what that means for them in regards to sex.
Reina,
Maybe that was the disconnect. I say the thing about casual sex, guys tend to always ask what you mean or say that it isn’t casual, blah blah blah. that’s when you hit ’em with the “I’m not into sleeping with someone I’m just dating.” They get the message loud and clear then. No need to embellish.
I think the other thing is, I have my patented “Four Burner Theory” (TM) hah hah! So I’m always seeing more than one man at a time. Keeps you from putting your eggs in one basket. Women who don’t do this tend to, without even being conscious of it, make the guy the focus of their energies. The menfolk can sense when they don’t have any real competition and when they sense that that’s what’s going on, that’s when they lean waaaaaay back and chill in the relationship/pursuit.
I think this is even more true in churches/faith centers because everyone is all in your business and many times girls/women have mistakenly come to believe that by having many suitors, they’ll be perceived as “easy” or “fast,” to quote my grandma’s favorite phrase, but that couldn’t be farther from the truth because MEN GOSSIP. If they’re all gossiping and the consensus is that none of them are getting any, then all you are is a wonderful woman whose company they all enjoy. Let the best man win! But faith-minded women will hunker down on one church-going guy instead and, unfortunately, find themselves in the same sort of “accidentally dysfunctionally dependent,” imbalanced relationship with a guy that non-church girls have…complete with the guy not making any courting effort, getting easy sex, or both.
I think, at the end of the day, you have to have conviction in what you’re doing and carry yourself in the matter. Truth is truth. Honor is honor. Virtue is virtue. And silence (with a good facial expression, wink, or snort/chuckle) is powerful. ;> I find that I rarely have to explain much because I don’t even let it get to that point. I nip it in the bud early on. But I prefer to play offense rather than defense. If I get to the point where I’m “defending,” that means I’ve already let things get too far (or off kilter) in the first place.
For example, I went out on a great date with this guy. We hit it off really well. He called a week or so later suggesting a date where he’d come over to my place and we’d watch a movie (yeah right). I just laughed and said “ohhh noooo” in that “no way, jose” kind of voice. He was all “why not?” And I said, laughing, “because you’re a stranger!”
Of course he was all “hurt” and was like “A stranger!?! I can’t come over to your place!?! A stranger!?! How am I a stranger!?!”
(because, of course, us going out all of ONE time means that we know each other SO well and of course I should totally let him into my apartment. hah!)
I laughed again and I said “What’s my dad’s first name?” And he said irritatedly, “I don’t know! How would I know that!?!” And I said, “Exactly. A STRANGER.”
He chuckled. {lightbulb goes on in his head}
But I’m an anomaly because girls–and grown women–it seems are suckers for the old “we have one date and now I’m coming over to your apartment” trick.
He also tried the other trick where men tell you that they’re looking for a woman who will make them a better man, to have a family, blah blah blah, which seems to cause women’s clothes to disintegrate and then cause them to fall backwards onto a bed.
Oh…Stacy doesn’t walk the plank that easily!
I knew what he was getting at by trying to come over to my apartment and he knew what I was getting at by not allowing him into my apartment. No need for discussion. He was obviously looking for hookups, so of course no other date-dates followed. Of course he tried to pull some last minute date offers, which I declined because I already had dates/plans lined up. After a while, those last minute offers stopped too. He weeded himself out. Que sera sera. HOW-EV-ER…if I bump into him on the street, there’s always a text or phone message waiting for me by the time I get home. No matter how many months go by. That date-date was almost two years ago. He still has my number in his phone.
Sharks always return to circle the water. :]
Stacy,
Ooo that is so true, they always come back….I run into those people all the time with some variation of the same reaction. One always gives me googly eyes, says how good I look and how nice I smell, and how much he misses my company. Of course, I’m loads of fun-he just wasn’t getting any. He is really nice looking but hasn’t had a girlfriend in 4 years, and told me he wasn’t going to “deprive” himself of sex right now. He is still alone and always looks very lonely. Good luck with that buddy! Don’t single men read the studies of how little sex most of them get for a lot of effort, and how much married men get for very little?
I cosign on the Four Burner Theory! Back in the day, no one would have questioned a woman with multiple suitors, for just the point you made, men talk and the truth would always bear out in her favor as long as she was chaste. And who wants to get all hung up over one guy- no fun.
When I was in college, I would stay away from what I would call the “3Ms”- any guy wanting to get together for a Massage, Movie, or hoMework.
No men set foot in my place, and I don’t even tell people where I live. I am pretty much super-vague on most common issues, until I get to know someone fairly well. A guy I work with asked me didn’t feel lonely and need some company, someone to keep me warm. I said ” No Hombres en la casa.” He started howling laughing and so did the other guys. Now they say this whenever they get wind I might be seeing someone. Its really funny, but even they know, without me having had to spell it out, precisely what I meant. I have often said it to guys that were starting to sniff around, and they get the point as well in a humorous way.
Good stuff…
“The “3Ms”- any guy wanting to get together for a Massage, Movie, or hoMework.”
“No Hombres en la casa.”
I am laughing so hard! These are GREAT Reina!!! I’m totally bootlegging these! :>
“He also tried the other trick where men tell you that they’re looking for a woman who will make them a better man, to have a family, blah blah blah, which seems to cause women’s clothes to disintegrate and then cause them to fall backwards onto a bed.”
Oh my word this is the oldest trick and its so slick but its such a line. They think family/baby talk as in “how many kids do you want to have?” will make your eyes shine and your panties drop. LOL
And every guy I date usually by date 2,3, or 4 tries to get me to come over to his place…usually at nite to “watch a movie”. Rarely during the day. or there’s some excuse like “I just got a new place and want you to see it.” When I turn them down early on they “get it.”
Also, in reference to what Stacy said about church girls. I am one of those chruch girls that has no qualms about dating several men at the same time. I have done it in fact I’m loathe to focus on one guy just because I’ve gone on a date or two with him. However, it is hard to do—most women complain that the guys don’t even ask them out. They may go months without a date (for me its been 4 months- things usually pick up in the spring/summer). In many churches the male/female ratio is tilted highly in favor of the men.
Funny stuff.
Your majesties Easybreezy, Stacy, and Reina,
Your wisdom delights Grace and me. If I were running a female charm school, I would hire all of you at whatever the cost.
Guy